[personal profile] legionseagle wishes fandom had a more progressive penal code

May. 3rd, 2011 04:13 pm
paxpinnae: What the Tardis is, is freedom. (Freedom)
[personal profile] paxpinnae posting in [community profile] metaquotes
Basically, all a very significant majority of the fandom's criticism of River can be summarised as:

"Prisoner at the bar; you stand accused of being Jack Harkness while in possession of a pair of ovaries. Do you plead guilty or not guilty?"


Context is discussing Mary Sues. Again. QWP.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 08:23 pm (UTC)
staranise: A star anise floating in a cup of mint tea (Default)
From: [personal profile] staranise
Oh, I love your icon.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 08:37 pm (UTC)
such_heights: amy and rory looking at a pile of post (who: river is a badass archaeologist)
From: [personal profile] such_heights
Well, yes.

<3 RIVERRRR <3

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 08:59 pm (UTC)
liseuse: (river song shoots guns sexily)
From: [personal profile] liseuse
So true.

I love her so, it just isn't even true.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 09:26 pm (UTC)
teapot_rabbit: Black and white cartoon rabbit head with >_< face. (DW_10 coat)
From: [personal profile] teapot_rabbit
But I don't like Jack Harkness either. They both annoy me.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 09:38 pm (UTC)
darlingfox: ([misc] read and learn)
From: [personal profile] darlingfox
Exactly what I was going to say. :/

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 09:51 pm (UTC)
teapot_rabbit: Black and white cartoon rabbit head with >_< face. (Default)
From: [personal profile] teapot_rabbit
We can form a small sad club and our motto can be "but I really don't dislike River just because she's female." I can't even discuss Captain Jack anymore, without it turning into a rant on why he's a terrible leader, arrrrgghhhh. (I did like him when he had the Ninth Doctor as a foil. That worked. Then his character kinda changed completely, and he lost the sexy hat.)

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 10:04 pm (UTC)
darlingfox: ([misc] read and learn)
From: [personal profile] darlingfox
I liked Jack with Nine and Rose, too. Unfortunately I could barely stand him in Torchwood. The show would've been a lot more enjoyable without him.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 10:18 pm (UTC)
teapot_rabbit: Black and white cartoon rabbit head with >_< face. (Default)
From: [personal profile] teapot_rabbit
My favorite episode of Torchwood is Countrycide - where there are not, in fact, any aliens at all.For a show all about aliens, this is probably a Bad Sign.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 11:35 pm (UTC)
brewsternorth: Electric-blue stylized teapot, captioned "Brewster North". (Default)
From: [personal profile] brewsternorth
Agreed about Captain Jack; he actually made a better 2-in-C to Nine, really, as opposed to trying to lead an ensemble, and his backstory up to that point was much more fitted to it too. And the whole idea of trying to make Torchwood A SHOW FOR GROWNUPS actually didn't do it many favours either.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 12:07 am (UTC)
teapot_rabbit: Black and white cartoon rabbit head with >_< face. (Default)
From: [personal profile] teapot_rabbit
And by "A SHOW FOR GROWNUPS" RTD apparently meant "who needs consistent characterization when we have indiscriminate snogging?" The snogging was nice and all, but it didn't make up for the characterizations wandering all over the everywhere.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 02:53 am (UTC)
cygnia: (uh-uh)
From: [personal profile] cygnia
Don't forget the heart-stabbing WANGST~!

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 04:26 am (UTC)
teapot_rabbit: Black and white cartoon rabbit head with >_< face. (Default)
From: [personal profile] teapot_rabbit
How could I possibly forget the WANGST~?! *headdesk*

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-03 11:54 pm (UTC)
undomielregina: Rusyuna from the anime Grenadier text: "Grenadier" (Default)
From: [personal profile] undomielregina
(I did like him when he had the Ninth Doctor as a foil. That worked. Then his character kinda changed completely, and he lost the sexy hat.)

Yes, yes yes yes! I feel like I'm practically to the point where I think of Torchwood!Jack as a different character entirely. DW!Jack is much more fun, and while some of that is the fault of the attempt to adult-ify TW, I think it was a bad idea to introduce a show where the hook is that we follow the adventures of a character we know and like, and then find out that he's turned into someone else entirely when we weren't looking.

But I like River, because she reminds me very much of DW!Jack -- he had a similar facility with ancient tech and cryptically tragic back-story, imo, for starters.
Edited (forgot to finish the last sentence) Date: 2011-05-03 11:54 pm (UTC)

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 12:11 am (UTC)
teapot_rabbit: Black and white cartoon rabbit head with >_< face. (Default)
From: [personal profile] teapot_rabbit
I think it was a bad idea to introduce a show where the hook is that we follow the adventures of a character we know and like, and then find out that he's turned into someone else entirely when we weren't looking.

Good god, yes. I am perfectly happy to believe Torchwood!Jack is a different character! It was kind of odd rewatching the DW episodes with Jack after watching Torchwood, for that very reason.

I don't hate River, she's just not my favorite character ever. To each their own, though! ^_^

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 02:11 am (UTC)
undomielregina: Rusyuna from the anime Grenadier text: "Grenadier" (Default)
From: [personal profile] undomielregina
I see nothing wrong with you not liking River! She's not my favorite character in season 5 or 6, although I'm having trouble saying who my favorite is. I really like everyone this time around and the last time that happened was with Nine.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 12:34 am (UTC)
ironed_orchid: River Song blows smoke off her revolver - text: Song. River Song. (Song. River Song)
From: [personal profile] ironed_orchid
Yes, but River is so much more than just a Captain JAck with girl parts.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 01:05 am (UTC)
faevii: (creepy irish ninja cat)
From: [personal profile] faevii
Cue the most oblivious person on the internet (a.k.a. me) stumbling by to quickly say: What? River and Jack ... have something in common??

I do not like River because of what she said to that one Dalek that one time. So there. [/cool story bro]

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 01:38 am (UTC)
risha: Illustration for "Naptime" by Martha Wilson (Default)
From: [personal profile] risha
I was just going to say the same thing. They're both... human time travelers? That's about all I can come up with.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 01:50 am (UTC)
faevii: (an actual sentence)
From: [personal profile] faevii
LOL. At least I'm not the only one then.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 05:43 am (UTC)
kelly_holden: A Yahoo! avatar edited to look more like me. Pudgy, freckly, blue-green eyes, long brown hair. (Default)
From: [personal profile] kelly_holden
They're both kinda smug, and have done bad things.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 06:02 am (UTC)
risha: Illustration for "Naptime" by Martha Wilson (Default)
From: [personal profile] risha
Maybe that's the disconnect then. "Smug" is a word that springs to my mind for River, which is at least 90% of what I dislike about her. It's not something I really associate with Jack, though. Like, at all.

"Has done bad things" is a weird one. So did Turlough and a number of others. And the Doctor.
Edited Date: 2011-05-04 06:09 am (UTC)

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 01:40 am (UTC)
risha: Illustration for "Naptime" by Martha Wilson (Default)
From: [personal profile] risha
Am I not allowed to find her irritating on her own merits, then? :(

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 04:22 am (UTC)
tree: river from firefly; text: little albatross ([firefly] a little albatross)
From: [personal profile] tree
every time someone talks about "river" i think of river tam, from firefly. dr who is confusing the hell out of me.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 08:06 am (UTC)
jackandahat: A brown otter, no text. (Default)
From: [personal profile] jackandahat
Oh thank god, it's not just me. I was thinking "Well, River kicks a lot of arse, but... she doesn't have sex, at all as far as we know. And I thought one of people's objections to Jack was he'd shag anything that stood still long enough."

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 01:04 pm (UTC)
tree_and_leaf: Watercolour of barn owl perched on post. (Default)
From: [personal profile] tree_and_leaf
She flirts a hell of a lot, though. Much like Jack (though River's not as prone to flirting in a way that looks suspiciously like sexual harassment). And I've always suspected that there's a lot of "All mouth and no trousers" to Jack*.


* Wow. In the context of Jack, that sounds a lot more obscene than it should do.

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 01:05 pm (UTC)
tree_and_leaf: Watercolour of barn owl perched on post. (Default)
From: [personal profile] tree_and_leaf
(And it may be worth adding that I don't think River flirting a lot is a bad thing.)

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 01:07 pm (UTC)
jackandahat: A brown otter, no text. (Default)
From: [personal profile] jackandahat
I don't remember that, but it's been a while since I watched. Jack... I don't think it's all mouth and no trousers (Which sounds filthy when it's about him) so much as "freaking out the 21st century kiddies by talking about it."

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 02:55 pm (UTC)
tree_and_leaf: Watercolour of barn owl perched on post. (Default)
From: [personal profile] tree_and_leaf
He definitely trolls...

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 04:49 am (UTC)
msilverstar: (david street smile)
From: [personal profile] msilverstar
well said!

(no subject)

Date: 2011-05-04 02:16 pm (UTC)
daxion: (TARDIS)
From: [personal profile] daxion
Sadly, my initial dislike of River was the same as my initial dislike of Martha. And the only reason I disliked them at all was because I watched four series all at once and was still reeling from Rose's departure.

That's one thing to be said for watching episodes every week, rather than in a 24 hour period.

But now that I've recovered (cough) I really like River. She's got sass.

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